Every race can be competant and versatile, but there are a few whose advantages don't make up the disadvantages.

1. Ghostwise Halfling
A halfling barbarian? With a penalty to STR? Maybe they could make an effective rogue or something, but their build makes no sense for a barbarian. Who wants 16 STR for a barbarian? Get a half-orc.

2. Gold Dwarf
The DEX penalty somewhat hampers their ability to make an effective... dwarf. It can be overlooked, but they are no match for their cousins, the shield dwarves.

3. Grey Dwarf
Similar to the above, these guys get a huge CHA loss. They have multiple goodies, but none are very big or very useful. Also, they are the only underdark race to not recieve magic resistance, but still have a hefty xp penalty.

4. Wild Elves
They could be useful, but I've never used them. Sorcerers don't need INT, but I like to have some for spirit of flame, etc.

5. Half-elves
They are somewhat useful, but for a non-roleplayer they are outshined by both humans and elves, making the whole "best of both races" thing somewhat ironic.

Am I overlooking something about these races?

1. Well, I might be able to imagine a halfling Barbarian without much STR, but able to multi to rogue for example. Interesting build, methinks. Even from a powergaming perspective.
2. Overlooked. Make good fighters in heavy armor, who really don't need more than 12 DEX.
3. They have these little things that come in handy, but will never turn the tide of a battle. Meh, fogrget about them.
4. Wild Elves are cool IMHO. Nothing spectacular, but not underpowered in any way.
5. Being any class comes handy, and saves bonuses against sleep and the like really pays off. Especially in the start.

1. Possible. However, I just don't like halfilings with greataxes ;)

2. I know, but IMHO the don't match up to the shield dwarf. Possibly for an all-dwarf party as the paladin (a dwarven paladin! No wait, a Dwarven fighter4/paladin! GAH!)

3. Righto!

4. True. I once took a wild elf sorcerer before I knew about spirit of flame, and have since opted for "smarter" builds.

5. True, but when deciding between half-elf and human, its saving throws against extra feats and skills. I take the feats and skills. The subtle advantace for the human is that, with an extra skill per level, they can minimize their INT and still have 2 skills per level, enough for cross-class skills. Very useful for a powerga... I didn't finish the word. I did NOT finish the word!

1. Ok, 16 strength, but in 3rd ed. they would have had +1 AC and attack. They still keep the +4 to hide. That's not really great. In this game, they áre useless.

3. I don't even understand the duergar in PnP.

4. they should have used either Sun elf(+2 INT instead of DEX) or Wild elf(+2 STR, +2 DEX, -2 INT,CON&CHA)

Okay, I'm bored, so I give you: The Race list, IMHO, of the best to the worst races. Anyone can poke at my list. If I am missing a benefit of a race, point it out and I will switch accordingly. Many of the races in the middle were more or less equal in my eyes, so I graded them according to my use of them. If you convince me of a power that stands out, I will switch them

1. Drow
2. Deep gnome
3. Human
4. Aasimir
5. tiefling
6. shield dwarf
7. Moon elf
8. Half Elf
9. Gold dwarf
10. Lightfoot Halfling
11. Strongheart Halfling
12. Wild elf
13. Rock gnome
14. Half orc
15. Ghostwise Halfling
16. Duergar

What think?

[ 01-27-2005, 03:30 PM: Message edited by: Marty4 ]

I almost always make half elves. They too can chose their favorite race, they live a little longer than humans, and get some elven bonuses.

Good point on the versatality, but I will maintain that they are still not as powerful as humans due to the above. However, I'll raise them a bit.

I think the shield dwarf and gold dwarf are underestimated. The +2 bonus vs. all spelllike effects is not to be underestimated!

Half Orcs are vastly underestimated. Yeah, sure, they loe 4 points to gain two, but being the only race in IWD2 that gives STR bonus, I'd say that makes up for it. Besides, who ever heard of a wise and beautifull barbarian who has a way with people? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

as long as you have 1 diplomat in your party that is NOT the Half-Orc you should be fine. My current party has a half-orc barbarian and man he kicks so much ass :-D