[Rataxes]

The Wizard Slayer's item restrictions were not meant to show what he was unable to wear, they were meant to show what he would refuse to wear.

But the thing is just that Wizard Slayers are supposed to refuse to use any item containing magic or associated with it. Bioware eased those very tight restrictions to allow for enchanted weapons, armors and healing potions, for balance and gameplay issues, while still keeping his refusal to associate himself with enchanted gear a considerable disadvantage.

But--A Potion that grants immunity to mind-controlling spells? A Ring that grants improved Saving Throws and Magic Resistance? A Book that lets me cast Spell Turning? A Cloak that deflects ALL spells cast directly at me? There is no question about it: A Warrior who is sworn to abhor dangerous magic and eradicate its practitioners would use such items.

Perhaps, but the class you're describing is the Inquisitor, Wizard Slayers have an altogether different relation to magic. They abhor it entirely and regard anything and anyone associated with it with suspicion. It's true that Bioware strayed from the PnP description when they allowed him to use certain enchanted items, but that is no reason to throw the most unique aspect of the Wizard Slayer in the bin altogether. Because lets face it, with the revised list of items the WS will use, he might as well not have any item restrictions at all.

Then there's your notion that Offense <=> Defense. While it's true that sometimes the best offense is defense, and vice versa, I don't agree that you can use that to justify someone who has specialized in hunting down a particular type of creature being better at defending himself from such creatures than he is at actually attacking them. I associate the term "slayer" with rather offensive and aggressive qualities, and indeed, the handbook kit description for the Wizard Slayer does read:

"Combat Compulsion: A Wizard Slayer must, in combat situations, seek out a mage or spell caster over any other opponents"
(from sorcerers.net)

which I interpret as Wizard Slayers having an almost natural instinct to actively attack evil spellcasters whenever they see them. Can you see why I think the Wizard Slayers offensive qualities should be more prominent than his defensive ones? The idea of a Wizard Slayer tackling mages by relying on his inpenetrable magic defenses is akin to a Kensai equipping a throwing dagger and the boots of speed to make certain he will never be involved in melee combat. Perhaps sound from a survival perspective, but clearly in conflict with the philosophy of both kits. You don't pick a Kensai if you want something else than a close range meat blender, and you don't pick a Wizard Slayer if you want someone to passively defeat a mage by letting him exhaust his spell supply on you.

There are monks for that, or wands of summoning.

What, you mean a loss of 4 THAC0 points, 1 ApR, 2 points of Damage per hit, and the inability to Dual-Wield efficiently means you think Wizard Slayers aren't capable of fighting anything but Mages? Last I checked, Paladins and Rangers were getting along just fine, as were Clerics. (In fact, now that I type those stats out loud, I don't think the RebalWS has enough disadvantages--I'm thinking of limiting their "Greater" HLAs.) And I think you'd be hard pressed to find a way to negate the cons of the RebalWS, unless you really think it's worth Dualing to Thief so you can use Ilbratha.

Negating cons can also be to have other members of your party compensate for the the weaker sides of one party member. RebalWS would be less overpowered in a solo game where he will have to live with being rather poor at melee combat (which hurts his ability to kill mages, no?). But what troubles me the most isn't really whether RebalWS is overpowered, it's primarily that you saw it fit to revamp the kit completely, remove his most unique aspect and replace it with completely different powers and flaws, based on personal opinions of what the Wizard Slayer is about that have no basis in existing kit descriptions. If the Wizard Slayer needs to be improved or changed, and I don't think any great changes are needed, surely it can be done without basically creating a new kit? (call it something else then).

I'd be in favour of this upgrade, assuming it can be done:

- Let the spell disruption on hit ignore mantle spells and PfMW. As I recall, the PnP version has an ability that lets his normal weapon strike with an enchantment of +1 per two levels, which allows him to hit creatures immune to normal weapons, but also punch through spells that block magical weapons, since his weapon isn't enchanted in the normal sense. This wouldn't be quite the same, but in line with the general idea that his spell disruption should ignore magical protections altogether.

In my opinion this single change would bring him closer to his PnP description, make him more uniquely useful, and thus make him comparatively capable enough against mages to hopefully in everyones eyes outweigh his considerable item limitations.

[ 04-20-2005, 07:04 PM: Message edited by: Rataxes ]