Fighting the "Boss" (A Poll)

[UncleJoe]

I like fighting the big, bad dude at the end, too. One of the Wizardry's (I can't remember which, but it was probably 6 or 7) had a REALLY tough boss at the end. I tried several times, but couldn't beat him. Had to reload and go get lots more experience. What a joy when he finally went to his well-deserved death! Had a similar experience with an M&M game, Clouds of Xeen, I think. I can't remember that any RPG had a really fantastic show/movie/etc. at the end, but Starflight II had a pretty good movie at the end (Yeah, I'm old enough to have played both Starflights, so don't ask). There may have been more; somebody send me some new memory chips.

[Sazerac]

Let me see...Wiz 6 had a couple of VERRRY tough "bosses" at the end...the Bane King and Rebecca. Actually three, if you count the wizard you have to fight right before them. Four, if you go through and fight Rebecca's brother the Dragon, at the very end.

In Wiz 7, you have to defeat the Dark Savant and his minions (quite a difficult fight, but much easier if you have the little "gift" you get from the good Witch on the Mountain Top). But then, there's that surprise ending...!

-Sazerac

[Wyvern]

Interesting thread!

Not a huge fan of the one big bad guy at the end but I'm also not certain of what might be creative alternatives. Perhaps piecing together a complex puzzle into one solution that "saves the world" - maybe from smog. LOL! I do know that I enjoyed many hours playing Diablo (over and over) not for the final confrontation but to improve my character and find new nifty stuff! I also especially enjoyed casting chain lightening across the room and watching the bolts fly!
In W&W I just enjoy moving around the land/environment. Would be nice if you could also find some more interesting treasures, ones that were better than you could ever make with enchantments and bless. And then there is swimming, yes I do like swimming!

Wyv

I like a "big boss" with LOTS of bad guys to try to help him cream my party!

Go ahead and TRY! Make me fight for my life! IIIIIIIIIIII Like it!


Moni

(may post more on this later, I have to leave right now for a few)

[Max]

Big boss....hmmmmm well yes a big boss at the nd of a game is good or what would be even better, would be to have a difficult ending where you are challenged by multiple foes one after the other kind of thing. The hardest and the last being the boss. So it would be kind of like running the gauntlet only one way in and one way out, once your in theres no going back to town and not even much time to heal up. You would have to be fighting your way through on your wits and cunning, with a big dose of brute force.

As far as W&W goes, as I have said somewhere before a G'ezard Ra ((spelling) but the lich you all know who I mean) type opponent would be good. if anyone has ever attacked him in skull castle they will know how hard he is to actually hit as he teleports all over the place and uses all the top spells, same ones you have, against you.

So maybe the big boss doesn't have to be some great monster that is nearly invinsible, but maybe just by making him elusive would be fun. To have a battle against an big boss that just sits there and lets you strick him is kinda boring but if he was teleporting all over so that you had to chase him would make for a good ending, he would have to stop to cast spells at you and that would be your chance to cast a spell at him before the chase starts of again.

Oh well thats a few of my thoughts on this subject, I'm outta here now before I start to ramble even more..lol.

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......shake it baby.

[mammawlin]

The Thing Is. . . like in WW, I think Cet should have been a lot tougher; reload tougher, like the Mantraps. Also, could have thrown in some Blue Demons and Red Demons, A truck load of baddies from throughout the entire game, even a few Lilies for good measure, to the point where we would run and run and have to use spells and mana out the yang yang and run some more - to the point of dying, ALMOST EVERYONE DIES! Shoot man, we had all that mana and the ability to heal the sickest of the sick and resurrect the dead even! Would have been nice to HAVE to use the Blood Bath and the Circle of Fire and Hands of Time and Summon the Undead and maybe even a Vanish or two. Worse than the battles in the Serpent Temple - tougher - get it! And I'm not through yet. . . I want it all. . .after the battle, there must be a spectacular happy ending with fireworks and we all get medals of honor and bravery and the storyline the dragon is telling is all about US! How fantastic we were in battle, how we didn't hurt the good guys, how we held fast to our vow and came out triumphant over evil! And the moral of the story is: when you grow up, be like *insert names of heroic party members here* and you will live a long and happy life, and when your life here is over, you are promised by Kerah herself a place in the heavens with the other angels forever and ever! The End (until the next time evil raises its ugly head)

Mammawlin

continuing...

I remember well in Wiz 7 being challenged to be tough, think, scheme, and use all my abilities combined to get through the fight with the Dark Savant and his minions alive. Ellyssia in W&W was another battle that had my blood pressure at what the rest of you consider normal LOL For me, whose "normal" BP is 80 over 60 (and NO I AM NOT DEAD OR ON LIFE SUPPORT!), it was a rush, a challenge and a test of my wits to survive.

I like the Wizardry method of being able to target seperate groups of monsters, being able to cast sleep on these guys, paralyze on those and silence on others. I think if W&W had that feature the fight with Elyssia would not have been so fun but without it, Wiz 7 (for me) may have been impossible.

I think RPG's should pose MORE hard fights and make the games a challenge from start to finish...bigger bad guys as you go along...not just this or that character renamed with more hit points but REAL graphic differences. No, this does not mean different colored same guy either or same guy with different hat...it means totally different!

Problem solving, puzzles and having to rely on your own wit also make a game better in my opinion...but this thread was about the end boss wasn't it?

I'll quit babbling and let the next forum member have a turn.


Moni

I need to add a P.S here LOL...I do like Wyv's idea of the possibility of having a creative alternative to an end boss "Perhaps piecing together a complex puzzle into one solution that "saves the world" - maybe from smog. LOL!"
That too, would be a satisfying end to a good game if the "boss" feature were eliminated. I like the idea as much as ending up being the only one left on the map with all the power!


Moni



[This message has been edited by Moni (edited 04-05-2001).]

From my limited experience with these types of games, I do enjoy that really tough endboss. I also enjoy an ending that is based totally on decisions made by the characters throughout the game, as well as their actions. That is the one thing that was most blatantly lacking in this game. You could whack a "good" NPC for the experience, and never have to worry about whether you did the right thing.
Before I got into W&W, I played Vampire: The Masquerade Redemption. It had its shortcomings, but overall, I thought it was a pretty fun game. It had some really tough bosses, and the endboss was pretty tough to figure out how to beat. However, once I did beat the Vukodlok, I was psyched!
Also, the ending, whether happy or sad, depended on the decisions and actions of the characters throughout the game. The vampires have "humanity points," and every time they killed a mortal or made a decision that went against their last threads of humanity, they lost humanity points. At the end, what happened to the main character and his true love depended on how you played your character throughout the game. I thought that was a pretty cool way of trying to make you decide how you wanted to play the game: do you want to be the good guy, or do you want to be evil? None of this, "I'm going to kill the innocent and still reap the rewards of the good champion at the end of the game," like we could in W&W.
Whew! Sorry about the rambling.... Thanks for indulging me!

[Sazerac]

Cyberpixie: You intrigue me! I never looked into "Vampire the Masquerade" because I thought it was for pseduo-Goth "vamp-wannabes", which is so tiresome. We have scads of those kinds of people around Dallas/Fort Worth, dressing up in tacky 18th century costume garb, painting their faces white, pretending to be vampires...so boring. Your description of the game, though, makes me think I should give it a second look. I did like the short-lived TV series "Kindred the Embraced" and this game sounds much like it did...of course, Kindred was sort of a cross between Vampires and "Wise Guy" and "Alien Nation"...but in a good way. Vampires in a mafia-like setting.

Anyway, thanks for the input! I may have to check that game out after all.

-Sazerac

I've never played the pen-and-paper or live action Vampire RPG, but like I said, the computer version was lots of fun, IMO, and the graphics were superb.
Another interesting note about the "humanity points" in Vampire: Your humanity rating did not just affect the final outcome of the game. If you lost too much humanity, your character could go into a permanent frenzy. At that point, you cannot control the character any longer, and he just kind of runs around, killing whatever crosses his path.
Saz....if/when you do try out Vampire, let me know what you think!