On the Right side of History.

[Donut]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Snipped

The point I was trying to make was that the NRO article claimed that the rest of the world "will eventually gravitate to the US" My article clearly shows there is no sign of that happening.

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by Donut: The point I was trying to make was that the NRO article claimed that the rest of the world "will eventually gravitate to the US" My article clearly shows there is no sign of that happening.

I agree, of course.

Chirac and Anan railed against the preemptive action doctrine. I agree, it is a bad doctrine that basically means "we'll make war when we want just like we did before the UN existed." If there is a compelling and tangible threat, and you must act, you should be able to prove it to the UN.

But, what stymies this view is the glacial speed with which things move at the UN. And, that is the most harmful thing of all. Until the UN can set systems in place to force leaders to come to A determination (one way or another) quicker, I'm all for tearing it apart brick by brick.

[Skunk]

Originally posted by Magik: I do know that there were a number of people here who predicted the US war (talking about the one with the Iraqi army) was going to be a hugely bloody affair and that it would last a loooong time...

I don't think that anyone predicted that the war with the Iraqi army would last long - most warned of a guerilla campaign.

There were quite a lot of us who thought that the war itself would last a long time - and it has so far lasted 6 months without any end in sight to the hostilities.

[Djinn Raffo]

Originally posted by Donut: The neocons have taken a country which was no direct threat to the USA, with no proven links to terrorist groups who would have attacked US interests and turned it into a theatre of terrorism with more targets than bin laden could ever have dreamt of. Sounds like Vietnam to me!

Maybe that was what the Bush administration was after all along. If we send some of our soldiers over there the terro's will stop attacking the homeland. Their forces will gravitate to one spot where we can deal with them. To bad about the civilians caught in the way.

Originally posted by Skunk: I don't think that anyone predicted that the war with the Iraqi army would last long -

Then you weren't looking.

[Djinn Raffo]

Originally posted by MagiK: quote: Originally posted by Skunk: I don't think that anyone predicted that the war with the Iraqi army would last long -

Then you weren't looking.
[/QUOTE]Talk about a revisionist quote MagiK! Come on you're quoting in true NRO style, read the rest of his post.

[Sir Taliesin]

I hardly think Iraq is even remotely like Vietnam. First of all the casualty rate is nothing like what it was in Vietnam. Hell more People get killed in New York city in one year, then what is happening in Iraq! 20 attacks a day! Big Whooo! Still not up to Vietnam standards. Give me a break!

Nor do I think we will be there more than a couple of years unless of course that air base we will probably set up in Northern Iraq counts. I expected that the administration would push for a constitution within the first year after the war. It means they are serious about not wanting an occupying army there any longer than necessary. We aren't trying to start an empire regardless of what anyone else thinks.

And TL, I was with you. when I got to "Chirac Said", I quit reading as well. Who cares what he has to say. All he is looking to do is drive a wedge between the US and the rest of Europe, so France can step and take it's "rightful place" as the head of the EU and lord it over the rest of Europe.

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by Djinn Raffo: quote: Originally posted by Donut: The neocons have taken a country which was no direct threat to the USA, with no proven links to terrorist groups who would have attacked US interests and turned it into a theatre of terrorism with more targets than bin laden could ever have dreamt of. Sounds like Vietnam to me!

Maybe that was what the Bush administration was after all along. If we send some of our soldiers over there the terro's will stop attacking the homeland. Their forces will gravitate to one spot where we can deal with them. To bad about the civilians caught in the way. [/QUOTE]I posted this a while back after having the same thought:

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[ 09-26-2003, 05:29 PM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[Skunk]

Originally posted by Sir Taliesin: And TL, I was with you. when I got to "Chirac Said", I quit reading as well. Who cares what he has to say. All he is looking to do is drive a wedge between the US and the rest of Europe, so France can step and take it's "rightful place" as the head of the EU and lord it over the rest of Europe.

Europe doesn't work that way - no single state can gain leadership in the manner that you describe: Blair tried it and has only achieved complete isolation from the rest of the EU - it will take him years to regain the lost influence.

In any event, Chirac's views represented the majority of thinking in every EU state including Britain and Spain (and in the case of the latter, public feeling against Aznar is so bad that he has decided not to stand again - an extraordinary decision for an incumbent Prime Minister to make.)

[ 09-28-2003, 10:04 AM: Message edited by: Skunk ]

[Attalus]

Originally posted by Donut: The point I was trying to make was that the NRO article claimed that the rest of the world "will eventually gravitate to the US" My article clearly shows there is no sign of that happening.

Then there are those of us who say, "Who cares?" [img]tongue.gif[/img]