More Annoying -- and Stupid -- Insurgent Attacks

[Black Baron]

The occupaytion forces as such do not bring hatred. Their actions do, however.
F.e: The ukraine people were happy and cheerful when Hitler conquered Ukraine. They were very happy till the point when Hitler began to excercise (sp?) his ideology of "untermensch".
If the previous regime was monstrous, the occupiying forces are viewed as saints, and vice versa.

The insurgents caused the allied troops to harm the citizens, thus causing hatred. that is their tactics that is as old as that metheorite (sp?) that fal into the house in new zealand.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by Masklinn: Don't mix everything up. Allied came to free us, and they did exactly and only that. They freed us and left. I see a huge difference there with the Iraq problem, don't you ? I am pretty sure that if they did free us then stayed for a year or more, ppl would have started to hate them as well. Instead of that they freed us and left, and for that we are forever grateful. And that is the correct way to free a country from a brutal opressor. Sometimes history should repeat itself. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Europeans did start to hate us. Look back at some newspaper articles of the day, and you'll see that we won the war, but were losing the peace. Of course it was just some and not all who felt that way. Iraq isn't such new ground after all.

I'm mixing nothing up. You made the occupation comparison. You want to compare today's coalition action in Iraq to the Nazi's occupation in France. I compare today's coalition to the Allies who liberated France. It is only mixed up because that doesn't conform to your point of view regarding Iraq.

The Allies freed Europe and left? Are you kidding? The US stayed in Europe to maintain the peace, and stayed in Europe spending billions, and stayed in Europe making money, and stayed in Europe influencing policy, and stayed in Europe, and stayed in Europe, and is still in Europe today. There may not be armed US soldiers walking the streets of Paris today, but it has been 50 years!!! It is a bit early to claim we'll stay that long in Iraq.

And don't dare tell me that a foreign army, with different culture, religion and language, occupying your country wouldnt piss you off. C'mon Ronn, I know it would. [img]smile.gif[/img]

A foreign army in my hometown when I wake up in the morning? Sure your right, but if the circumstances were different, and a foreign force set me free and returned my country to me and my neighbors, I'm not so sure I'd be pissed.

There is a difference between being conquered and being liberated. Both tend to arrive in a cloud of death, but I hope I'd be smart enough to know the difference.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by Masklinn: And you may not agree with my point of view, you may explain why, but please don't say it's "silly". Especially in this case. You just can't imagin US being invaded, can you ?

It was silly because of the 'Absolute' nature of the statement you made. Your initial statement made it seem as if any foreign army in another country for any reason would have to be there as a conqueror, which is of course, untrue.

No, I can't imagine any army invading the US today. Not anymore anyway, but as a child of the Cold War I certainly spent quite a bit of time worrying about the Soviets doing just that. Masklinn being from the US doesn't mean I've never known the fear of losing my freedom. In fact, based on our age difference, I'd be willing to bet I've feared it more than you have.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Donut: I may have mentioned this before Timber, you'll need to stop thinking like an American for a while if you want to understand why they do this. And until you understand you will never find solutions.

Well perhaps others should show us by example and stop thinking like what ever they are and start thinking like Americans so they can help in finding solutions, unless of course it's only a one way street. But if it's only a one way street then how can we be expected to walk in anothers shoes if those that want us to do so won't walk in ours?

[Timber Loftis]

They freed us and left. I see a huge difference there with the Iraq problem, don't you ?

A difference in degree only. France already had an approved provisional government to step in and take over, so returning the peace and the government was able to happen more quickly. As well, the universal, in France and in the world, acceptance of the expelled government allowed it to be put in place without all the criticism the US's attempts at installing a government have been met with. Believe me, we ALL want out as soon as it is possible -- but I hope, and I hope others hope, that we will stay long enough to make sure the transfer of government is done responsibly. Shouldn't we?

[Dedzy]

As I understand it, they aren't interested in benefitting Iraqi citizens. They just want to sew chaos so that another Taliban-like theocracy can rise up and take over the whole of the middle east.

[Donut]

Originally posted by Cerek the Barbaric: quote: Originally posted by Donut: I may have mentioned this before Timber, you'll need to stop thinking like an American for a while if you want to understand why they do this. And until you understand you will never find solutions.

Then by all means, please do enlighten us. [/QUOTE]I have long given up trying to achieve the impossible but if I thought you were remotely interested I would make yet another attempt.

BTW - I don't have to find the solution. That's what I pay our politicians for!

[Donut]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: quote: Originally posted by Donut: I may have mentioned this before Timber, you'll need to stop thinking like an American for a while if you want to understand why they do this. And until you understand you will never find solutions.

Well, I'd like to know exactly what you mean by that, and how I am to accomplish that. Nevertheless, so long as we keep killing more of them than they do of us, there will be solution someday -- so long as we can stomach the war of attrition. Maybe I don't want to think like them -- maybe I just want to see them dead. [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/noevil.gif[/img] [/QUOTE]I'm not sure who you mean by "they".

Understanding why they do things is not the same as accepting their point of view as being right. Even if you accept that they have a case you don't have to agree with the methods they use.

e.g The ANC terrorist attacks in South Africa. I fully supported the views of the ANC but opposed their violence. Eventually it was the sporting boycott of South Africa in support of the ANC that brought about the release of Mandela and the dismantlement of apartheid.