Schizophrenia or Spiritual Awakening?

[Yorick]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: Yorick, my point was that I don't believe there to be such a thing as 'health', whether it be bodily or spiritual. There are just different states of existance. Without the hypothetical (and I daresay illusory) ideal against which to compare one's physical state, there can be no degradation or improvement. Just alteration of form. I think that body is constantly in flux, with proteins entering and leaving and cells birthing and cells dying. And in turn, the individual body forms merely a smaller 'protein' within a larger ecosystem, which is also in constant flux. Thus, this constant flow, this constant metamorphosis, is not conducive to a notion of 'the ideal' or 'health'. Nor is it conducive, in my opinion, to the idea of 'life' and 'death' as polar opposites....

All logically consistent. Solid mate.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Well in my case, the "voices" in my head "explained" to me what was happening. Or in other words I recieved guidance from on the inside in the form of words, visions and dreams. I also actively seek spiritual growth and having episodic expiriences similiar to Schizophrenia on this path is a well documented phenomenon from across time and cultures. Oh, I also asked other people more knowledgable and expirienced than me in the realm of Mysticism/Shamanism. There is a structure and purpose underlying expiriences like mine that greatly differs from schiztophrenic delusions.

Who do you believe these voices were?
Do you find the Christian notion that they are demons offensive or are you open to that idea?

[chimaera]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: my point was that I don't believe there to be such a thing as 'health', whether it be bodily or spiritual. There are just different states of existance. Without the hypothetical (and I daresay illusory) ideal against which to compare one's physical state, there can be no degradation or improvement. Just alteration of form. I think that body is constantly in flux, with proteins entering and leaving and cells birthing and cells dying. And in turn, the individual body forms merely a smaller 'protein' within a larger ecosystem, which is also in constant flux. Thus, this constant flow, this constant metamorphosis, is not conducive to a notion of 'the ideal' or 'health'. Nor is it conducive, in my opinion, to the idea of 'life' and 'death' as polar opposites....

You know, a body does not consist only of proteins. And your personal beliefs should not be a basis for deciding about a patients health.

Schizophrenia is a brain disease, not only a change in behavior. The (spiritual) approach of psychologists might not be enough in that case.

[ 09-02-2004, 12:39 PM: Message edited by: chimaera ]

[Yorick]

Originally posted by chimaera: quote: Originally posted by The Hierophant: my point was that I don't believe there to be such a thing as 'health', whether it be bodily or spiritual. There are just different states of existance. Without the hypothetical (and I daresay illusory) ideal against which to compare one's physical state, there can be no degradation or improvement. Just alteration of form. I think that body is constantly in flux, with proteins entering and leaving and cells birthing and cells dying. And in turn, the individual body forms merely a smaller 'protein' within a larger ecosystem, which is also in constant flux. Thus, this constant flow, this constant metamorphosis, is not conducive to a notion of 'the ideal' or 'health'. Nor is it conducive, in my opinion, to the idea of 'life' and 'death' as polar opposites....

You know, a body does not consist only of proteins. And your personal beliefs should not be a basis for deciding about a patients health.

Schizophrenia is a brain disease, not only a change in behavior. The approach of psychologists might not be enough in that case. [/QUOTE]Fair points.... interesting discussion.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: Also, to Yorick and Chewbacca, I assume your faiths involve the interaction of incorporeal entities with 'physical' bodies? Does being 'possessed' or 'ridden' by the spirit/daemon involve a suspension of 'rational' thought in your opinion? In which case, if brain damage also results in such irrationality, can any distinction be drawn between brain damamge spiritual transcendance?

Sorry, Chewie answered but I did not.

I don't know. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[chimaera]

To complicate the discussion further
Your perception of the world is based on the sensory information processed by your brain -
and if your brain is functioning incorrectly...

[ 09-04-2004, 02:34 AM: Message edited by: chimaera ]

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by chimaera: To complicate the discussion further [img]graemlins/firedevil.gif[/img] Your perception of the world is based on the sensory information processed by your brain - and if your brain is functioning incorrectly...

To function incorrectly, there must a 'correct' way of functioning, so please tell me what this is.

[chimaera]

Considering the number of dictionaries available on the web, no.

[Nightwing]

Chewy hit the nail on head head when he said he got through this with guidance. However my point is to treat the mental illness from the early stages with spiritual training as well as conventional methods, to wait and decide is to late. This is a treatment program from the beginning if not started in the early stages it may be to late to incorporate the training.

Luvian, there is way to much reserch to support this concept to ignore it. Not all Mentaly ill patients have the same degree of illness and not all will respond to this treatment but it should be part of their treatment. There are a lot of mental health professionals who think the same way you do with good reason. I said in the beginning this is still considered to be radical treatment in the western cultures.

People describe being in a place so complete and are so connected they don't want to leave. Therfore they stay in teir world longer and longer until it's to late. Like Chewy described he was able to have guidence through it. This must have been an awsome experiance Chewy.

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by chimaera: Considering the number of dictionaries available on the web, no.

Heh, sweet. You've told me all about you that I needed to know