Kensai vs Bezerkers

[Rockstar]

Hi everyone,

Just a simple question. On the basis of PURE class fighters, which do you think is the better SOLO class? A level 40 bezerker or a level 40 kensai? Disregard dual classing.

Which of these do you think would win in a 1 to 1 battle with both wielding two powerful weapons and the bezerker wearing the best armour in the game (white dragon scale i believe).


Bezerker has the advantage of dual wielding with a high armour class and being able to throw axes/daggers with the aid of armour and a shield. Kensai's can only gain armour bonuses through single weapon style and also by using the same items bezerkers can. On the other hand the speed and combat bonuses of the kensai means it can erradicate most enemies far quicker. ... but is this trade off worth it and is it survivable as a solo character.

Experienced players. Please enlighten me on your views lol [img]smile.gif[/img]

thanks all!

[Armen]

their basic AC might not be *that* different though kensai with shield amulet and the +2AC bonus would have a base of 2 iirc and could wear the ring of protection+2 to give 0 - so that's what your comparing your bereserker's magical armour too - damage type modifiers will make a big difference though *but* the kensai will have a bigger THACO advantage than the berserker will have an AC advantage so if it's pure hacking them my instinct would be kensai as it'll hit faster and harder on each hit and hit more often

the weapons would decide it though - celestial fury, flail of ages etc. have effects that can immobilise the opponent - the question then would be whether berserker rage ability protects against weapon effects - personally i'm not sure if it does

ps: kensai's can throw axes and daggers too - it's their loophole through the no-missile restriction

EDIT: in terms of a solo character i think the berserker is more managable and would lead to fewer re-loads - the bereserker rage protects you against a load of spell effects that are game-ending for a soloist - of course both are *possible* to solo

[ 01-31-2006, 01:35 PM: Message edited by: Armen ]

[ister]

I must be missing something here, because I don't see how it can be close. Number of attacks is the same. Berserker probably has 8 or so AC better than the kensai. Kai isn't going to matter much - high level characters do so much damage that the base weapon damage is pretty trivial. But there is one advantage that the kensai has that will swamp everything the berserker has going for him. Kensai get +1 to hit +1 damage per level. The +13 to hit more than makes up for the lower AC of the kensai, but really, these guys are level 40 - each will hit every time. They get exactly the same number of attacks. But the kensai has +13 damage per hit! +2 from rage is much much smaller.

Simple question really. If two character hit 95% percent of the time, have exactly the same number of attacks, and the same number of hit points, but one does and extra 11 points of damage per hit, who do you think will win?

[Cam_H]

You're asking two different questions:

"which do you think is the better SOLO class?"

Berserker - as Armen notes, the Berseker's rage protects from most solo-ending mind spells. There's also more versatility with the use of missile weapons (e.g. Arrows of Dispelling, Kuo Toa bolts, etc.).

"Which of these do you think would win in a 1 to 1 battle"

It depends upon the level and how far they're standing apart ...

... One failed save vs. Kuo Toa stunning bolt from the Berserker, and it's game over. [img]smile.gif[/img]

With that said, at high levels, even with 'rage', the Kensai probably would come out on top for the reason ister has identified. I'm sure that there's a cross-over point in levels in terms of the most likey candidate however that would take into account the THACO and AC bonuses from the Berserker's rage and the Kensai's innate skills.

[Klorox]

I think the Kensai would win in a 1 on 1 battle, but the Berserker is an overall better, more powerful, and more survivable character, especially if you're playing solo.

[True_Moose]

I'd second Klorox. Berserker rage against magical enemies makes them far better all around characters. In a 1on1 melee fight, Kensai may hold their own, but overall, against different types of opponents, a berserker is far more versatile.

[Andraste]

If you're playing the game, or just generally role playing, the relevant questions are not along the lines of "Who would win head to head at level 40?", but more like "Which one would do better in a room full of vampires at level 12?"

Of course, the answer here is the Beserker, although I'm sure there are other game-based instances where the Kensai would do better - I just can't think of one at the moment.

[ister]

I do agree, but I think there are (a few) game situations where the kensai is better. At the highest levels (like 25 or more) your saves get to be good enough that rage is less of an advantage. And against the very toughest melee opponents (who will hit almost all the time regardless of AC) the kensai has a slight edge in that he can kill it a little quicker. Still the kensai is very much a specialist, the berserker has huge advantages against a lot of different opponents while the kensai has a slight edge against a few less dangerous opponents.

As to a specific in game example - I think the kensai will do better against a bunch of unsupported fire giants when both are level 30. But either should romp there [img]smile.gif[/img]

[True_Moose]

I think the kensai is more effective as a party member. The thing to remember is the kensai is a very specific role: to deal damage. Kensai(s?) are pretty one-dimensional in nature, which is why so often they are dual-classed to improve their combat flexibility. Berserkers are a better solo class, because of their ability to tank/absorb damage and resist status effects. A kensai should be used less as a main tank, and more as a sniper, causing huge damage while staying out of the line of fire.

[Rockstar]

I completed a solo elven fighter in BG a while ago and he has the following stats. I wouldn't make him a bezerker because i feel that elves should always be standard fighters or kensais. Dwarves are better for bezerkers.

Is this characters stats good enough to survive the game as a SOLO KENSAI

stats:
str 19
dex 20
con 18
int 8
wis 8
cha 10

abilities:
to hit 3
damage 7

AC: 6

HP: 98

THACO: 14

___

i finished the game in BG using a long sword single wield quick changing between a long bow. It was very effective both ranged and melee.

I would use the grand mastery adjustment patch because i feel that it is legal as it is per the D&D rules