Kensai/Thief

lost prophet · 03-26-2005, 02:08 PM

Can you all compile your knowlege about this class into this topic for me?. It seems to me that this could be a very powerful class if used correctly and I'd like to learn about it, so it would be much apprieciated if you could all enlighten me on such things as pros, cons, versibility, good weapon/item combinations, tactics and anything else you can think of.

Im doing multi media at school and we get a whole term to make a website that will be marked at the end of it all, Im planning to do mine on the BG series as it interests me and there is heaps to write about it. So there will prolly be quite a few posts from me seeking information about things that a powergamer would never think of learning about (tactics comes to mind...)

cheers,

EDIT: grammer, shocking.
EDIT: before you post i would just like to let everyone know that i might be using what you put donw here in my guide in the exact same words. I cant think of a reason why people would worry about this but i thought i might as well be safe than sorry

[ 03-26-2005, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: lost prophet ]

whathuh · 03-26-2005, 04:31 PM

I'll start the data organization.

Determining your levels.
Kensais get all their special abilities every 3rd and 4th level. I'm not sure about base warrior abilities, as even volothamp can't help me out there. Therefore, it is only logical to dual at level 9 12 15 or 16. 12 gets all the abilities (12 is both a multiple of 3 and 4). 9 sacrifices one of each ability, but allows for a much much much easier reactivation. 15 allows that one extra damage, but 16 goes ahead and gives one more kai and move. My opinion, if you are playing solo, dual at 16. If not, or you are playing SoA only, dual at 12.

Next up, proficiencies. Obviously, you want to make good use of your kai ability, and I have just the thing for that. How about celestial fury, Belm, and bracers of blinding strike. Thats 9 attacks all doing MAX damage. Of course, Crom would probably be better in offhand for its massive strength boost, but you are a sword saint right? and you cant backstab with a hammer. Other notes of interest, firetooth +3 is the best dagger in the game, it hits everyone except a few monsters, and it also does double damage unless you fix it with a mod or something.

Tactics:
stealth is your absolute best friend. I highly reccomend having the cloak on non-detection so you can waste enemy true sights, then go in for the kill. If you are facing difficult opponents, kai before you hit them, then watch them chunk. Dont forget about groups that are not initially hostile. If you hide, hit, and fade, you can take out one opponent, and then run away unscathed.

Other tactics:
throw your dagger, run away, hide in shadows, repeat.

Cheap cheap tricks:
If you ever get blinded, you might think "ugh! time to reload!" I say nay, you blind me, so I get to cheese you til you die a horrible firey or poisonous death. Please note that while blinded, you can't see any monsters, so hide in shadows. Then, set a trap. Instantly, it goes off and kills everyone in the room. If it didnt, hide again and repeat. For this reason, it might be a good idea to blind yourself (level 1 spell blinds for one turn). You can use the wizard eye to see, or a familiar, or another character.

Another creation cheese. By dualing to a thief, you have the unique opportunity to gain exp simply by disarming traps and picking locks. Potions allow you to almost instantaneously become an uber-thief for up to 3 hours. Also, consider leaving quests unfinished, so you regain your exp after you dual, giving the 50000 exp to just your thief side, shooting you up to half the BG exp cap. Then, of course, there is the proficiency cheese. When you gain your proficiencies for a fighter, put them into a grand mastery place, or a place that thieves can't access. Then, when you make your thief side, choose 2 other classes of weapons and then gain exp. Level up as normal, but once you gain an extra prof point, press escape and continue your journey to reactivate your kensai. Then, once you have reactivated it, you will notice the 3 or 4 proficiencies you saved up are placeable like you were a fighter. That way, you don't waste them on weapons you will never use.

If you plan on making a site about bg, PLEASE make it informative with data and such. Don't forget to take a look at sixofspades' excellent spoiler free site. It contains a vast amount of data with a very small load time. (link is in his signature)

lost prophet · 03-26-2005, 04:47 PM

Great post!! just what im looking for.

My site will have the usual( character creation, classes balh blah ) but will also discuss more indepth things that i enjoy writing about, such as good kit combinations, powergaming vs roleplaying, the background of the main characters and any other ideas people give me or I come up with.

Yeh i have read Sixes awsome guide and thats what gave me the inspiration to write my own. His was great and is the standard I hope to achieve in my own guide.

Dace De'Briago · 03-26-2005, 06:24 PM

Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Get to L24 as a Kensai.

* 12 WP (5* Katana, 5* FoA, 2* dual wield)
* -6 Speed Factor to weapons
* Warrior HLA's
* +6 THAC0/Damage Kensai Bonus (EDIT: Whoops, probably +8)

Dual class. Get to L28 as a thief.

* Use any Item...
* Assassination...
* Grand Mastery from the fighter class. Backstabbing with Celestial Fury is rather nice.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

[ 03-26-2005, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: Dace De'Briago ]

lost prophet · 03-26-2005, 06:35 PM

Lol that would be very hard to start a level 1 thief somewhere in "the first city" in ToB would it not?

note: anyone know where i can get the stats for celestial fury?

Illumina Drathiran'ar · 03-26-2005, 06:37 PM

Katana +3
To enchant a katana is no simple process. Unlike conventional weapons, the katana is already a near-perfect fighting sword. To improve it usually requires a sacrifice, perhaps a dying samurai might beg a Wu Jen to infuse his fighting spirit into the spirit of the katana. The wielder of an enchanted katana, such as this one, must respect the customs of Kara-Tur and of the samurai who once carried this blade into battle. Not doing so could drastically change one's luck for the worse.

STATISTICS:

Equipped Abilities:
Lightning Strike: Once per day
Blindness: Once per day
Combat Abilities:
Booming Thunder whenever the sword strikes an opponent
(Stun, Save vs. Spell)
Shocking Blow chance when sword strikes an opponent
(5% chance of 20 additional electrical damage)
THAC0: +3 bonus
Damage: 1D10 +3
Damage type: slashing
Weight: 3
Speed Factor: 1
Proficiency Type: Katana
Type: 1-handed
Requires: 6 Strength
Not Usable By:
Druid
Cleric
Mage

whathuh · 03-26-2005, 06:49 PM

Download shadowkeeper, google for it. It searches through your own files, and then converts them so you can read em. That way, it will even display mod items like celstial fury +5. If you choose to add item stats to your site, I suggest you make it sort of like mike's rpg center, but a little more informative. Shoot, you can even copy all that, but just make sure you cite it and edit it to be more correct (2d4 is different than 2-8, or at least it SHOULD be, I'm not sure how those types of die work).

Dace De'Briago · 03-26-2005, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by whathuh:
Download shadowkeeper, google for it. It searches through your own files, and then converts them so you can read em. That way, it will even display mod items like celstial fury +5. If you choose to add item stats to your site, I suggest you make it sort of like mike's rpg center, but a little more informative. Shoot, you can even copy all that, but just make sure you cite it and edit it to be more correct (2d4 is different than 2-8, or at least it SHOULD be, I'm not sure how those types of die work).

2d4 gives exactly 2-8...

lost prophet · 03-27-2005, 12:35 AM

Thanks for that Illumina. Right now the guide is about 3 pages long lol, so it will make for very hard reading. Im trying to work out how to make thumbnails and hyperlinks using the "geocities page maker", when i work that out then it'll be put into clickable sections for a more user friendly guide.

I have looked at other peolples guides (sixes, mikes rpg center) and am getting good information from them.

2d4 is the type of calculation being made and 2-8 is the range of possible scores from the calculation.

EDIT: hey look at that lol The Magister.

[ 03-27-2005, 12:37 AM: Message edited by: lost prophet ]

Dace De'Briago · 03-27-2005, 01:14 AM

http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...925;p=1#000012

It refers to the Kensai > Mage, but you'll probably find something useful there.

03-26-2005, 02:08 PM	#1
lost prophet Drow Warrior Join Date: October 23, 2004 Location: Perth, Western Australia, Australia Age: 33 Posts: 297	Can you all compile your knowlege about this class into this topic for me?. It seems to me that this could be a very powerful class if used correctly and I'd like to learn about it, so it would be much apprieciated if you could all enlighten me on such things as pros, cons, versibility, good weapon/item combinations, tactics and anything else you can think of. Im doing multi media at school and we get a whole term to make a website that will be marked at the end of it all, Im planning to do mine on the BG series as it interests me and there is heaps to write about it. So there will prolly be quite a few posts from me seeking information about things that a powergamer would never think of learning about (tactics comes to mind...) cheers, EDIT: grammer, shocking. EDIT: before you post i would just like to let everyone know that i might be using what you put donw here in my guide in the exact same words. I cant think of a reason why people would worry about this but i thought i might as well be safe than sorry [ 03-26-2005, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: lost prophet ] __________________ I have a dream, we all have dreams.

03-26-2005, 04:47 PM	#3
lost prophet Drow Warrior Join Date: October 23, 2004 Location: Perth, Western Australia, Australia Age: 33 Posts: 297	Great post!! just what im looking for. My site will have the usual( character creation, classes balh blah ) but will also discuss more indepth things that i enjoy writing about, such as good kit combinations, powergaming vs roleplaying, the background of the main characters and any other ideas people give me or I come up with. Yeh i have read Sixes awsome guide and thats what gave me the inspiration to write my own. His was great and is the standard I hope to achieve in my own guide. __________________ I have a dream, we all have dreams.

03-26-2005, 06:24 PM	#4
Dace De'Briago Silver Dragon Join Date: December 28, 2002 Location: Wales Age: 43 Posts: 1,617	Zzzzzzzzzzzzz. Get to L24 as a Kensai. * 12 WP (5* Katana, 5* FoA, 2* dual wield) * -6 Speed Factor to weapons * Warrior HLA's * +6 THAC0/Damage Kensai Bonus (EDIT: Whoops, probably +8) Dual class. Get to L28 as a thief. * Use any Item... * Assassination... * Grand Mastery from the fighter class. Backstabbing with Celestial Fury is rather nice. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. [ 03-26-2005, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: Dace De'Briago ] __________________ Warning: Powergamer

03-26-2005, 06:35 PM	#5
lost prophet Drow Warrior Join Date: October 23, 2004 Location: Perth, Western Australia, Australia Age: 33 Posts: 297	Lol that would be very hard to start a level 1 thief somewhere in "the first city" in ToB would it not? note: anyone know where i can get the stats for celestial fury? __________________ I have a dream, we all have dreams.

03-26-2005, 06:37 PM	#6
Illumina Drathiran'ar Apophis Join Date: July 10, 2002 Location: I can see the Manhattan skyline from my window. Age: 38 Posts: 4,673	Katana +3 To enchant a katana is no simple process. Unlike conventional weapons, the katana is already a near-perfect fighting sword. To improve it usually requires a sacrifice, perhaps a dying samurai might beg a Wu Jen to infuse his fighting spirit into the spirit of the katana. The wielder of an enchanted katana, such as this one, must respect the customs of Kara-Tur and of the samurai who once carried this blade into battle. Not doing so could drastically change one's luck for the worse. STATISTICS: Equipped Abilities: Lightning Strike: Once per day Blindness: Once per day Combat Abilities: Booming Thunder whenever the sword strikes an opponent (Stun, Save vs. Spell) Shocking Blow chance when sword strikes an opponent (5% chance of 20 additional electrical damage) THAC0: +3 bonus Damage: 1D10 +3 Damage type: slashing Weight: 3 Speed Factor: 1 Proficiency Type: Katana Type: 1-handed Requires: 6 Strength Not Usable By: Druid Cleric Mage __________________ http://cavestory.org PLAY THIS GAME. Seriously. http://xkcd.com/386/ http://www.xkcd.com/406/ My heart is like my coffee. Black, bitter, icy, and with a straw.

03-26-2005, 04:31 PM	#2
whathuh The Magister Join Date: July 26, 2004 Location: NC Age: 36 Posts: 142	I'll start the data organization. Determining your levels. Kensais get all their special abilities every 3rd and 4th level. I'm not sure about base warrior abilities, as even volothamp can't help me out there. Therefore, it is only logical to dual at level 9 12 15 or 16. 12 gets all the abilities (12 is both a multiple of 3 and 4). 9 sacrifices one of each ability, but allows for a much much much easier reactivation. 15 allows that one extra damage, but 16 goes ahead and gives one more kai and move. My opinion, if you are playing solo, dual at 16. If not, or you are playing SoA only, dual at 12. Next up, proficiencies. Obviously, you want to make good use of your kai ability, and I have just the thing for that. How about celestial fury, Belm, and bracers of blinding strike. Thats 9 attacks all doing MAX damage. Of course, Crom would probably be better in offhand for its massive strength boost, but you are a sword saint right? and you cant backstab with a hammer. Other notes of interest, firetooth +3 is the best dagger in the game, it hits everyone except a few monsters, and it also does double damage unless you fix it with a mod or something. Tactics: stealth is your absolute best friend. I highly reccomend having the cloak on non-detection so you can waste enemy true sights, then go in for the kill. If you are facing difficult opponents, kai before you hit them, then watch them chunk. Dont forget about groups that are not initially hostile. If you hide, hit, and fade, you can take out one opponent, and then run away unscathed. Other tactics: throw your dagger, run away, hide in shadows, repeat. Cheap cheap tricks: If you ever get blinded, you might think "ugh! time to reload!" I say nay, you blind me, so I get to cheese you til you die a horrible firey or poisonous death. Please note that while blinded, you can't see any monsters, so hide in shadows. Then, set a trap. Instantly, it goes off and kills everyone in the room. If it didnt, hide again and repeat. For this reason, it might be a good idea to blind yourself (level 1 spell blinds for one turn). You can use the wizard eye to see, or a familiar, or another character. Another creation cheese. By dualing to a thief, you have the unique opportunity to gain exp simply by disarming traps and picking locks. Potions allow you to almost instantaneously become an uber-thief for up to 3 hours. Also, consider leaving quests unfinished, so you regain your exp after you dual, giving the 50000 exp to just your thief side, shooting you up to half the BG exp cap. Then, of course, there is the proficiency cheese. When you gain your proficiencies for a fighter, put them into a grand mastery place, or a place that thieves can't access. Then, when you make your thief side, choose 2 other classes of weapons and then gain exp. Level up as normal, but once you gain an extra prof point, press escape and continue your journey to reactivate your kensai. Then, once you have reactivated it, you will notice the 3 or 4 proficiencies you saved up are placeable like you were a fighter. That way, you don't waste them on weapons you will never use. If you plan on making a site about bg, PLEASE make it informative with data and such. Don't forget to take a look at sixofspades' excellent spoiler free site. It contains a vast amount of data with a very small load time. (link is in his signature)

03-26-2005, 06:49 PM	#7
whathuh The Magister Join Date: July 26, 2004 Location: NC Age: 36 Posts: 142	Download shadowkeeper, google for it. It searches through your own files, and then converts them so you can read em. That way, it will even display mod items like celstial fury +5. If you choose to add item stats to your site, I suggest you make it sort of like mike's rpg center, but a little more informative. Shoot, you can even copy all that, but just make sure you cite it and edit it to be more correct (2d4 is different than 2-8, or at least it SHOULD be, I'm not sure how those types of die work).

03-27-2005, 12:35 AM	#9
lost prophet Drow Warrior Join Date: October 23, 2004 Location: Perth, Western Australia, Australia Age: 33 Posts: 297	Thanks for that Illumina. Right now the guide is about 3 pages long lol, so it will make for very hard reading. Im trying to work out how to make thumbnails and hyperlinks using the "geocities page maker", when i work that out then it'll be put into clickable sections for a more user friendly guide. I have looked at other peolples guides (sixes, mikes rpg center) and am getting good information from them. 2d4 is the type of calculation being made and 2-8 is the range of possible scores from the calculation. EDIT: hey look at that lol The Magister. [ 03-27-2005, 12:37 AM: Message edited by: lost prophet ] __________________ I have a dream, we all have dreams.

03-27-2005, 01:14 AM	#10
Dace De'Briago Silver Dragon Join Date: December 28, 2002 Location: Wales Age: 43 Posts: 1,617	http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...925;p=1#000012 It refers to the Kensai > Mage, but you'll probably find something useful there. __________________ Warning: Powergamer

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